Thunderbird -- Creature #665

[NyxNoire]

Spoiler

Such a cute ball of fluff.

[VilaWolf]

Be very careful with Thunderbird.
This is one of those things you have to do right; to honor Thunderbird is a wonderful thing.

Just... keep in mind that we're touching on deeply held cultural beliefs with him.

Spoiler

http://www.native-languages.org/thunderbird.htm

Name: Thunderbird
Tribal affiliation: Sioux, Arapaho, Wichita, Ojibwe, Salish, many other tribes
Native names: Wakinyan (Sioux), Animikii (Anishinaabe), Boh'ooo or Etcitane:bate (Arapaho), Bha'a (Gros Ventre), Cigwe (Potawatomi), Enaemaehkiw/Inaemehkiwak (Menominee)
Related figures in other tribes: Thunders (Iroquois), Thunder Beings (Lenape), Thunderers (Cherokee)

The Thunderbird is a widespread figure in Native American mythology, particularly among Midwestern, Plains, and Northwest Coast tribes. Thunderbird is described as an enormous bird (according to many Northwestern tribes, large enough to carry a killer whale in its talons as an eagle carries a fish) who is responsible for the sound of thunder (and in some cases lightning as well.) Different Native American communities had different traditions regarding the Thunderbird. In some tribes, Thunderbirds are considered extremely sacred forces of nature, while in others, they are treated like powerful but otherwise ordinary members of the animal kingdom. In Gros Ventre tradition, it was Thunderbird (Bha'a) who gave the sacred pipe to the people. Some Plains tribes associated thunderbirds with the summer season (in Arapaho mythology, Thunderbird was the opposing force to White Owl, who represented winter.)

Thunderbirds are also used as clan animals in some Native American cultures. Tribes with Thunderbird Clans include the Kwakiutl and Ho-Chunk tribes. On the Northwest Coast, the thunderbird symbol is often used as a totem pole crest.

To read actual legends of Thunderbird check the link under the spoiler.

[Darkkstar]

these are awesome! I've got a couple of pairs already.

[DarkRider]

Be very careful with Thunderbird.
This is one of those things you have to do right; to honor Thunderbird is a wonderful thing.

Just... keep in mind that we're touching on deeply held cultural beliefs with him.

Spoiler

http://www.native-languages.org/thunderbird.htm

Name: Thunderbird
Tribal affiliation: Sioux, Arapaho, Wichita, Ojibwe, Salish, many other tribes
Native names: Wakinyan (Sioux), Animikii (Anishinaabe), Boh'ooo or Etcitane:bate (Arapaho), Bha'a (Gros Ventre), Cigwe (Potawatomi), Enaemaehkiw/Inaemehkiwak (Menominee)
Related figures in other tribes: Thunders (Iroquois), Thunder Beings (Lenape), Thunderers (Cherokee)

The Thunderbird is a widespread figure in Native American mythology, particularly among Midwestern, Plains, and Northwest Coast tribes. Thunderbird is described as an enormous bird (according to many Northwestern tribes, large enough to carry a killer whale in its talons as an eagle carries a fish) who is responsible for the sound of thunder (and in some cases lightning as well.) Different Native American communities had different traditions regarding the Thunderbird. In some tribes, Thunderbirds are considered extremely sacred forces of nature, while in others, they are treated like powerful but otherwise ordinary members of the animal kingdom. In Gros Ventre tradition, it was Thunderbird (Bha'a) who gave the sacred pipe to the people. Some Plains tribes associated thunderbirds with the summer season (in Arapaho mythology, Thunderbird was the opposing force to White Owl, who represented winter.)

Thunderbirds are also used as clan animals in some Native American cultures. Tribes with Thunderbird Clans include the Kwakiutl and Ho-Chunk tribes. On the Northwest Coast, the thunderbird symbol is often used as a totem pole crest.

To read actual legends of Thunderbird check the link under the spoiler.

Yeah I was thinking of this when I saw these, I really like them, but this could go in the wrong direction very quickly if not handled with care.

[MSolara]

Be very careful with Thunderbird.
This is one of those things you have to do right; to honor Thunderbird is a wonderful thing.

Just... keep in mind that we're touching on deeply held cultural beliefs with him.

Spoiler

http://www.native-languages.org/thunderbird.htm

Name: Thunderbird
Tribal affiliation: Sioux, Arapaho, Wichita, Ojibwe, Salish, many other tribes
Native names: Wakinyan (Sioux), Animikii (Anishinaabe), Boh'ooo or Etcitane:bate (Arapaho), Bha'a (Gros Ventre), Cigwe (Potawatomi), Enaemaehkiw/Inaemehkiwak (Menominee)
Related figures in other tribes: Thunders (Iroquois), Thunder Beings (Lenape), Thunderers (Cherokee)

The Thunderbird is a widespread figure in Native American mythology, particularly among Midwestern, Plains, and Northwest Coast tribes. Thunderbird is described as an enormous bird (according to many Northwestern tribes, large enough to carry a killer whale in its talons as an eagle carries a fish) who is responsible for the sound of thunder (and in some cases lightning as well.) Different Native American communities had different traditions regarding the Thunderbird. In some tribes, Thunderbirds are considered extremely sacred forces of nature, while in others, they are treated like powerful but otherwise ordinary members of the animal kingdom. In Gros Ventre tradition, it was Thunderbird (Bha'a) who gave the sacred pipe to the people. Some Plains tribes associated thunderbirds with the summer season (in Arapaho mythology, Thunderbird was the opposing force to White Owl, who represented winter.)

Thunderbirds are also used as clan animals in some Native American cultures. Tribes with Thunderbird Clans include the Kwakiutl and Ho-Chunk tribes. On the Northwest Coast, the thunderbird symbol is often used as a totem pole crest.

To read actual legends of Thunderbird check the link under the spoiler.

Yeah I was thinking of this when I saw these, I really like them, but this could go in the wrong direction very quickly if not handled with care.

we already have Quetzalcoatls and Tenera Dogs, which may also... touch a sensitive fiber? In their respective cultures, and nothing ever happened with them. If anything, I view these birds as an awesome contemporary depiction of a figure of folklore. Don't really know how they could have handled these with more care than they did, seeing that they made a pretty accurate depiction of the bird itself (huge, powerful, noble) without touching any specific cultural reference (and sticking to MS universe.) It's not like they satirized them, or made a puny bird named "Thunderbird" in irony. Plus, the sprite is awesome.

Just my two cents.

That being said, I would love for them to take an Argentinian mythological creature or folklore story to turn into a creature here. *hint hint*

[Kestrad]

Be very careful with Thunderbird.
This is one of those things you have to do right; to honor Thunderbird is a wonderful thing.

Just... keep in mind that we're touching on deeply held cultural beliefs with him.

Spoiler

http://www.native-languages.org/thunderbird.htm

Name: Thunderbird
Tribal affiliation: Sioux, Arapaho, Wichita, Ojibwe, Salish, many other tribes
Native names: Wakinyan (Sioux), Animikii (Anishinaabe), Boh'ooo or Etcitane:bate (Arapaho), Bha'a (Gros Ventre), Cigwe (Potawatomi), Enaemaehkiw/Inaemehkiwak (Menominee)
Related figures in other tribes: Thunders (Iroquois), Thunder Beings (Lenape), Thunderers (Cherokee)

The Thunderbird is a widespread figure in Native American mythology, particularly among Midwestern, Plains, and Northwest Coast tribes. Thunderbird is described as an enormous bird (according to many Northwestern tribes, large enough to carry a killer whale in its talons as an eagle carries a fish) who is responsible for the sound of thunder (and in some cases lightning as well.) Different Native American communities had different traditions regarding the Thunderbird. In some tribes, Thunderbirds are considered extremely sacred forces of nature, while in others, they are treated like powerful but otherwise ordinary members of the animal kingdom. In Gros Ventre tradition, it was Thunderbird (Bha'a) who gave the sacred pipe to the people. Some Plains tribes associated thunderbirds with the summer season (in Arapaho mythology, Thunderbird was the opposing force to White Owl, who represented winter.)

Thunderbirds are also used as clan animals in some Native American cultures. Tribes with Thunderbird Clans include the Kwakiutl and Ho-Chunk tribes. On the Northwest Coast, the thunderbird symbol is often used as a totem pole crest.

To read actual legends of Thunderbird check the link under the spoiler.

Yeah I was thinking of this when I saw these, I really like them, but this could go in the wrong direction very quickly if not handled with care.

we already have Quetzalcoatls and Tenera Dogs, which may also... touch a sensitive fiber? In their respective cultures, and nothing ever happened with them. If anything, I view these birds as an awesome contemporary depiction of a figure of folklore. Don't really know how they could have handled these with more care than they did, seeing that they made a pretty accurate depiction of the bird itself (huge, powerful, noble) without touching any specific cultural reference (and sticking to MS universe.) It's not like they satirized them, or made a puny bird named "Thunderbird" in irony. Plus, the sprite is awesome.

Just my two cents.

That being said, I would love for them to take an Argentinian mythological creature or folklore story to turn into a creature here. *hint hint*

Okay, I did not know thunderbirds were literal gods in some tribes' mythology This...might be a little insensitive, then? Especially given the bit in the description about how thunderbirds can be used as mounts? That said, MS manages to skirt a lot of issues by being set in an entirely separate universe from this one, so the tone of a lot of creatures taken from other cultures doesn't feel appropriative. But just because no one complained about creatures before doesn't automatically mean this one also isn't a problem. And while I think the sprite is freaking awesome, that doesn't mean it's okay if someone else thinks the name/description is insensitive towards their culture.

tl;dr I think only someone who belongs to the culture thunderbirds come from can decide whether this is respectful or not.

[VilaWolf]

Okay, I did not know thunderbirds were literal gods in some tribes' mythology This...might be a little insensitive, then? Especially given the bit in the description about how thunderbirds can be used as mounts? That said, MS manages to skirt a lot of issues by being set in an entirely separate universe from this one, so the tone of a lot of creatures taken from other cultures doesn't feel appropriative. But just because no one complained about creatures before doesn't automatically mean this one also isn't a problem. And while I think the sprite is freaking awesome, that doesn't mean it's okay if someone else thinks the name/description is insensitive towards their culture.

tl;dr I think only someone who belongs to the culture thunderbirds come from can decide whether this is respectful or not.

I cannot say if it is or isn't, that's not my place. I'm just a part-time Folklorist.

My first thought when I was the adult sprites was that is was pretty damn cool. Seriously great work by the artists.
My second thought went immediately to an interview I saw of a Native American school teacher talking about having to explain California's 140+ school level (primary/elementary up to local colleges) Native "inspired" sports mascots to her students, all of whom are themselves Natives.

Given the wide range of Tribes and how their stories are different depending on the culture - some do consider Thunderbirds to be just another natural animal in the world, if an extremly large part of nature. You can best see those differences in the various depictions. Other do consider him to the one of the Great Nature Spirits.

For just a couple:

Spoiler

Which is why I said in my initial post -- to honor -- Thunderbird is a great thing. But it has to be done with care and in respect to the People who hold this story in their heart.

It's kind of the first rule any Folklorist learns: (and why I'm most oft posting Rage!Salad when an event goes too far) Retelling a story keeps it alive in the mind and in the heart and lets us pass it along to the next generation -- but only if we remember that when telling the story.